Problem solving

I wanted to create this topic because i saw a fair amount of criticism in the other threads. Let’s discuss some solutions to our various gripes, and problems. The way i see it, we have three main problems that need to be cleared up if unity 2020 is to succeed. First, we need to get electoral college support. US electors are pledged to support a certain party, so until we figure out how to sway them, our popularity doesn’t matter extremely much. Secondly. We need to refine our mission statement. Mentioning the words republican, trump, democrat, or biden are trigger words for a lot of people. It’s a great idea to have people in the parties work together, but that shouldn’t be our entire pitch. Finally, we need direction. From what i’ve seen there’s been.plenty of talk about why the plan is a good idea, and our broad chess moves, but no small steps. We neeed something to channel our energy towards. I don’t know a lot of politics, but these are the problems i see with unity 2020. Also since this is a problem solving thread, and not a problem listing thread, i have some possible solutions to put forward for these problems.

  1. If anyone can find a way to contact our electoral college, we should call them, and let them know that we won’t declare a suit if they change their vote, and we want them to endorce unity 2020.

  2. Instead of focusing on taking power away from the other parties, let’s designa pitch around removing the confusion, and the slander from our legal system. Enphasize how unity 2020 can work on better patriotism, and camradery rather than hadred.

  3. One of the great things about this community is whie it was created by a few people, they aren’t the only ones to think of next steps. If you have an idea on a cool graphic, logo, or anything for unity2020 comment it down below. I know i’d love to work on any ideas.

Now let’s make #unity2020 more than about members for presidency. Let’s make it about all the people that propelled it to greatness!

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I don’t have anything to add, but I agree with all you said and love seeing more emphasis on developing tactics.

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@Casdool Does this mean you’ve scrapped I no longer feel able to promote Unity2020 ?

@Tray_Cook 1. Do you understand what the electoral college is and their commitment to vote as they do? The electoral college is comprised of all members of both houses of Congress plus representatives for Washington D.C. State Laws regulate how they vote. Only in case of no clear winner is leeway on voting granted. Hard for me to imagine that members of Congress would support Unity2020. Not a viable option.

@Tray_Cook 2. I assume you mean “political system” which is the legislature and executive branches rather than “legal system” which is the judiciary branch. I feel that the power of the DNC and the RNC are huge problems that need to be solved, and that Unity occupies that battleground.

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Nope, it doesn’t mean that! I am still interested in it personally, but I have enough concerns with the movement that I can’t promote it with enthusiasm/conviction to others unless those kinks get ironed out.

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@Casdool I’d hate to see you go. Thanks for participating.

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@TRON I am not super informed when it comes to politics. I thought that the electoral college was hired by congress. And i may be misunderstanding you but weren’t the popular votes pretty clear in the 2016 election? Or do you mean that one candidate has to win by a certain margin.

When i said legal system, i was talking more about our entire government. I wasn’t thinking about a specific branch.

Finally, i agree with you about the dnc, and rnc. However that’s not going to be a good enough reason for most people.

Hope i didn’t put that rudely.

@Casdool Let’s iron them out then! I scanned your thread, and to summarize, you don’t particularly like the candidates put forth in the ballot, and you don’t like how stagnant we’ve been. Waiting for more and more opportunities. I have an idea about asking the candidates to support us. I can edit video, but i’m not such a great presenter. Have you ever taken a crack at it?

@Casdool hope i didn’t overstep my bounds there. Sometimes i let my excitement get the better of me. If you don’t want to participate i completely understand. I heard in a business group that a video is the best way to get your point across, and makes a bigger impact on people

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@Tray_Cook Hi Tray,

I’m actually very impressed with everything I’ve seen with Tulsi. As far as I can tell, she is the ideal candidate for this movement.

I don’t know that it’s stagnation that’s frustrating me, but it may be more of a clumsiness that I think may be a result of a clear path/direction. We know where we’re at and we know where we end up, but I don’t see a clearly articulated strategy of how to get there. I do see many volunteers working very hard, so I really wouldn’t ever detract from all their efforts.

I am glad you’re taking such an initiative, but I don’t think I’d be the right person to be involved. Whatever you’re planning, you may want to check with volunteers/representatives to make sure it would be sanctioned by Unity and that you wouldn’t mistakenly undermine the movement. I have seen GRYF and Brendan comment on this board, and I believe their both volunteers who could connect you to the right people if you’re not already registered as a volunteer.

Some things I’d love to see:

  1. More clear statements on the issues Unity is planning to resolve and how it plans to resolve them. (The duopoly, political corruption, etc.). Some of this content is tossed around during campfires, but I think well-defined statements on the website would go a long way in articulating what we stand for.
  2. Updates on things that are actually being done and what progress is being made. How is this movement doing? I love the campfires, but there’s rarely any discussion of tactics or specifics. They’re often somewhat general and don’t usually evolve into anything tangible. They’re important to have, but I think we need something additional to keep the engine going and the support base engaged. Even e-mails with important bulletpoints of the campfire discussion that highlight why it was an important conversation in propelling the movement forward.
  3. I’ve said this a couple times before, but I wonder… has anyone reached out to the prospective candidates? Were they asked what their terms of getting on board would be? A groundswell would be necessary to win, but is it actually necessary for them to join? Maybe they already share our vision and don’t need any incentive to join so we’re making things needlessly more difficult for ourselves.
  4. Has a groundswell been defined in a measurable way? If we knew we were working toward 10 million e-mail subscribers, or 5 million likes on facebook, or 20 million views on YouTube, then we could evaluate our success or shortcomings. If there isn’t a measurable goal how will we know whether we achieved it or not?

These are just a few easy things that I think would go a long way in keeping people actively engaged.

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You don’t need to apologize at all. Keep your enthusiasm up, and make sure you utilize the proper channels.

I think the biggest problem Unity has right now is a lack of a game plan, or more specifically a lack of realism.
We have a leader of some sort (Bret) who is building a core group of followers through his contagious idealism, which is a very important first step; every revolutionary movement runs on some amount of idealism, we have to believe we can make a difference against the odds.
But we need a leader/face that has some realism to balance it out. Idealism is the fuel, the idea is the engine, but realism is the wheels and steering. We need a leader of this movement who is capable, patriotic, and courageous. Bret is patriotic and courageous, and he is capable of many things, but being the frontman for a movement that needs to scale as much as this one does is not one of them as far as I can tell. (No offense meant to Bret)

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@Tobias_Lansberry Yes! These are my feelings exactly.

@Tobias_Lansberry well, this thread is about problem solving. Have anyone in mind! Maybe as a co-leader, or even lead investor. :grinning:

The “electoral college” is comprised of some number of “electors” from various parties (including Libertarians and Greens) per state who pledge to cast their ballot for the party that won in their state. (@TRON, the electors are not members of congress - the number of electors is partially determined by a state’s number of congress members)

When a voting citizen marks a line on the ballot, they are essentially voting for that party’s electors to be activated. once activated, those electors are pledged (or in some states required) to cast their vote for the ticket of their party.

If the Libertarians or Greens agree to swap in our Unity ticket for their own, then the electors activated for that party would be casting their electoral college vote for our ticket. The link between ballot—>party—>electoral college is central to the ballot access plan and in some subtle ways renders-irrelevant the names printed on the physical ballot.

(edited to tag @Tray_Cook as he had some questions specifically addressed here)

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It isn’t irrelevant at all. I’m not sure the LP or Greens specific policy, but the major parties all have rules/bylaws for swapping candidates prior to an election, and those rules involve majority votes of the caucus and/or reconvening the convention. Please correct me if I’m missing something, but if I cast a vote for Jo, as an example, you can’t just do a switch-a-roo and count that towards Tusli. With ballots being mailed in some states already, and in many more this week, this .001% chance of a ticket without a ballot has lost any mathematical possibility of coming true.

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There are two different issues here:

  1. The names on the ballots already printed and how that interacts with the electoral college
  2. Whether the LP or Greens would change their ticket

You’re discussing #2. I’m discussing #1 because that is what was objected to earlier in the thread.

if I cast a vote for Jo, as an example, you can’t just do a switch-a-roo and count that towards Tusli.

Your “vote for Jo” is really your vote to have The Libertarian party’s electors in the electoral college vote for a ticket. You are never directly voting for the president in our system. If the party changed tickets and nominated electoral college electors accordingly, then yes - your vote for Jo [really a vote for the LP’s electors] would in effect be switch-a-roo'd and count toward the Unity ticket.

This is all plainly here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Electoral_College and in states’ individual election codes, all publicly-posted.

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There have been several examples of what you say is “plainly” stated that directly conflict with that assertation. Ray v Blair in 1952 ruled that states can force electors to pledge to vote the party nominee, and several “faithless” electors who voted for Colin Powell in 2016 instead of Hillary were fined and that was upheld at the state supreme court level. I don’t believe this is a clear and obvious path to the ballot.

Ray v Blair in 1952 ruled that states can force electors to pledge to vote the party nominee

I hope you’ll agree that that is a different point… If the party’s nominee is the Unity ticket, then the elector would still be voting for the party’s nominee.
Once again, I believe you’re conflating #2 from above (whether the parties will replace their nominees) with #1 (whether this ballot access plan is legal and possible)

Faithless electors are a different and important point, but let’s try to close up what we’re already discussing before we add in even more tangents.


Edit: I regret my tone a bit in previous messages. I hope I’m not coming off as rude. I realize this is a relatively novel and counter-intuitive plan, and the details of it aren’t necessarily explicitly stated anywhere. I’ve been steeping myself in election law a bit lately and I guess as a result I have some context that I’m forgetting is not clear.

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I suggest the “Unity” concept be discussed on two levels, current time and post 11/3. Current dissatisfaction has limited growth potential due to the compressed time frame. Establishing a post 11/3 path will provide the means to campaign on local and national levels. It can be a platform to promote our candidate and pressure incumbents, i.e. the tea party movement. The recent election in Rhode Island could provide a possible roadmap.

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Re the Electoral College: It’s important that we be accurate.

The Electoral College does not include any Congressional Members. Rather, federal officials are specifically excluded. Electors are chosen at the state level by the parties themselves in most states, although there a small handful that use a variety of more democratic methods. Electors pledge their support for specific candidates and are, in most states, legally bound to their pledge though with minor material consequences.

The political consequences for parting with ones pledge, however, are fatal. This fact alone makes the Elector path an impractical and unwise focus.

That said, well done @Tray_Cook to be thinking outside the box. Everybody keep your thinking caps on!

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